09:31:31 From Jan Bramkamp : but the core team got hired away over the last few years (e.g. the lead of the apple swift language, some paid llvm developer as well) 09:31:44 From Jan Bramkamp : the compiler was too good for its own good 09:31:57 From John Helmers, Minnesota, USA : my connection is flaky - I'm going to drop of the video feed. 09:32:26 From donal : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_0QlhYlS8g 09:35:01 From Samuel Falvo : All bitcoin transactions are tagged with the sending and receiving party's IP addresses. Unless you're using an onion server of some kind, this can be traced to individuals. 09:35:06 From donal : I wanted to suggest we watch 30 min of the Factor language presentation on Google Tech Talks. This fellow has been working on a new high language on top of Forth. Uses colon definitions. Then have a group discussion on it. 09:35:33 From Jan Bramkamp : if you bought bitcoins via a wiretransfer your identity has been tied the wallet receiving the bitcoins 09:36:45 From John T. Draper : There is an untraceable crypto currency 09:39:47 From Kevin Appert : That's what Al Capone would've said. 10:04:42 From Jax : https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1-VnFQb01FPstQc9kjd966ROS243wjDHYCTclXVQMixo/edit?usp=sharing 10:06:37 From Kevin Appert : Having trouble, please start Sam after questions for Jax done. 10:21:20 From Kevin Appert : Should be "when something goes terribly awry" 10:24:44 From Jan Bramkamp : big green button at the button 10:27:13 From Samuel Falvo : The code repository for the Kestrel-1/ForthBox emulator "k1emu" and its IM/F disk0 image is here: https://git.sr.ht/~vertigo/k1emu However, the IM/F version I'm still working on is on a development branch "debug16", here. https://git.sr.ht/~vertigo/k1emu/tree/debug16 The greater ForthBox project repository is hosted in a separate repository (for historical purposes): https://git.sr.ht/~vertigo/forthbox 10:27:39 From Samuel Falvo : (Apologies to Joey; I clicked on Everyone in chat window, but for some reason it reverted back to a private chat. :( ) 10:35:16 From Jan Bramkamp : which risc v core did you use for comparison? 10:36:53 From Jan Bramkamp : a SERV core is a lot smaller (but bit serial) and even something like picorv32 uses only 800-2000 LUTs depending on configuration 10:37:06 From Samuel Falvo : So, an FPGA in the same class as a Lattice iCE40LP8K. 10:37:48 From Samuel Falvo : Yeah, my KCP53000 used around 4000 LUTs, IIRC (on Spartan 3 fabric). 10:39:36 From Jan Bramkamp : i use JTAG/SWD as terminal connection to cortex-m chips (stm32, rp2040) running mecrisp stellaris forth 10:39:48 From Jan Bramkamp : it’s a lot faster than normal serial consoles 10:43:56 From Jan Bramkamp : is there a timer to notice if you’re running short of time? 10:46:18 From Jan Bramkamp : will it run on an icebreaker board? 10:47:32 From Jan Bramkamp : even for experienced forth developers sometimes a local variable is the lesser evil 10:48:05 From Samuel Falvo : Locals are great when working with heavy arithmetic; pure stack is ideal for control. Having the ability to choose appropriate tools is a big win. 10:48:36 From Jan Bramkamp : imo overreliance on local variables leads to poor factoring 10:50:23 From Jan Bramkamp : factor is cool, but i would call it the bastard child of lisp and forth instead of just a strange forth 10:51:05 From Jan Bramkamp : factor also has dependent types (with runtime type checking) 10:51:43 From Jan Bramkamp : e.g. a sequence is a one dimensional collection like a list or array 10:51:51 From Jan Bramkamp : and a pair is just a sequence of length two 10:54:58 From Jan Bramkamp : how does your forth engine compare to something like the J1 cpu or mecrisp ice? 10:57:54 From Jan Bramkamp : is it possible to reconfigure the fpga at runtime from the forth system? 10:58:53 From Bob Armstrong : I looked at Pestov's Factor in 2010 : http://cosy.com/CoSy/CoSy/ReCoSy20101200.html . His Google tek talk is worth watching . 11:02:30 From Jan Bramkamp : i haven’t used factor in ca. 8 years 11:03:27 From Jan Bramkamp : it used to move at break neck speed, but the core developers left university and moved on to gainful employment :/ 11:03:33 From Bob Armstrong : Because recursive fns are so important , I tend to use stackframes instead : http://cosy.com/4thCoSy/Code/CoSy/ParameterPushing.f , although there is a locals vocab 11:05:16 From Jan Bramkamp : double cell division would take about 64 cycles on a 32bit system 11:06:17 From Jan Bramkamp : (1 bit per cycle) 11:06:34 From Jan Bramkamp : just an example of a very long opcode 11:08:39 From Bob Armstrong : Following : " It is better to have 100 functions operate on one data structure than 10 functions on 10 data structures. " Alan Perlis : Epigrams in Programming CoSy has just 1 header : `( Type Count RefCount )` . So finding the ` Type of an object is just ' @ . Type 0 is list of lists . 11:10:15 From Samuel Falvo : I suspect the space taken is from the pipelining architecture. Pipelines use a lot of DFFs, which a LUT typically only has one per. 11:11:25 From Dave Jaffe : "Bat out of Hell" was that a MeatLoaf reference? 11:11:43 From Jax : 😁 11:14:23 From Samuel Falvo : Thank you Don; I was skeptical of the idea of an outer interpreter in hardware at first, but it looks like you're making good headway with it. I'd be interested in seeing it when the project is fully fleshed out. 11:15:11 From donal : Turned out not to take that many LUTs. 11:16:25 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : please copy here the Facebook Group URL of Don Golding about AI+Robotics 11:22:18 From Kevin Appert : Anything you miss can be seen on our YouTuber channel, https://www.youtube.com/c/SiliconValleyForthInterestGroup 11:23:09 From John Helmers, Minnesota, USA : very impressive. 11:24:12 From donal : Ai & Robotics Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1304548976637542/ 11:24:42 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : Facebook page: This content isn't available right now When this happens, it's usually because the owner only shared it with a small group of people, changed who can see it or it's been deleted. 11:24:53 From Jan Bramkamp : https://gist.github.com/Crest/c9fc26dc334dbf102ca8cb04e21d1b6d 11:25:17 From donal : what is your facebook name? 11:25:24 From donal : I will invite you 11:25:50 From Jan Bramkamp : i used something similar in mecrisp stellaris forth to work around the lack of XIP flash support on a chip 11:25:58 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : Rolf Hemmerling ( but from Germany, not the US guy ) 11:26:14 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : fb.com/hemmerling 11:26:19 From donal : Here is the link to join: https://fb.me/g/6bMZ79qwd/3Oh7A8ZO 11:26:35 From donal : it will expire in 48 hours. 11:26:37 From Jan Bramkamp : the find hook loaded the parameters to a word in executable memory into ram 11:27:12 From Jan Bramkamp : and returned the same execution token for different parameters 11:27:20 From Jan Bramkamp : of course this only works for some kinds of words 11:27:36 From donal : Rolf, try the link first. I want to see if multiple people can use the same link. 11:28:32 From donal : Rolf you are in... 11:28:48 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : thanks 11:28:53 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : it works 11:30:15 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : somehow; I don´t have sound anymore, though reloading the browser ( my Windows sound works = tested by YT video ).??? 11:30:16 From donal : We are keeping it private for now. We will open to the public when we have a system working. 11:30:58 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : I did not know that thats possible :-), to have really-private group, for free, with FB 11:31:17 From donal : Brad, loved that code! 11:32:06 From Rolf Hemmerling, Germany : sound works, after new login (ok) 11:32:41 From donal : 😁 11:33:48 From Kevin Appert : 🗿 11:34:04 From Brad Nelson : Thanks donal 11:35:28 From Kevin Appert : Easter Island Moai, nobody knows what it means. 11:38:15 From donal : The link for AI & Robotics worked for 3 people. Great! 11:38:42 From Jax : Gotta run, thank you all! 11:39:40 From Kevin Appert : Ironically, IIXX was the 22nd Legion...IIXX was how people associated with the XXII Roman Legion used to write their number. The practice may have been due to a common way to say "twenty-second" in Latin, namely duo et vice(n)sima (literally "two and twentieth") rather than the "regular" vice(n)sima secunda (twenty second).[36] Apparently, at least one ancient stonecutter mistakenly thought that the IIXX of "22nd Legion" stood for 18, and "corrected" it to XVIII.[36] (from Wikipedia) 11:41:50 From Brad Nelson : Looks like Excel has the 1900 bug to be compatible with Lotus 1-2-3: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office/troubleshoot/excel/wrongly-assumes-1900-is-leap-year 11:42:36 From Brad Nelson : And then they stuck with it for compatibility with old sheets. 11:43:53 From Bill Ragsdale : bill@billragsdale.cc for suggested challenges. 11:47:56 From Brad Nelson : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_processor 11:48:52 From John Helmers, Minnesota, USA : https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/artificial-intelligence/processors.html 11:49:30 From John Helmers, Minnesota, USA : https://www.ambientscientific.ai/index.html 11:50:15 From John Helmers, Minnesota, USA : http://www.differencebetween.net/technology/difference-between-ai-processor-and-normal-processor/ 11:51:26 From Jan Bramkamp : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jazelle 11:51:28 From donal : John you joined the group.. 11:57:42 From John Helmers, Minnesota, USA : Thanks everyone. Good meeting.